Brian, when started I was like everyone else…I had 100% faith in the devices I used, that was a horrible mistake…for me. You see, at the time I was like you and what seems like the majority of the people who respond on this board, not concerned abut the quality of the radon testing. Just placed my devices according to protocol, get the report then pass/fail. But two years ago, I had an out of state client who, over the span of 3 weeks, who tried to buy 3 houses. I did the home inspections and radon for him and his wife (who was not present in the beginning). He insisted that I use the canisters, I assured him that the CRMs were 100%. But I ended up using the canisters I also placed my single radon devices at each location. The results for one of the houses (between the canister and the CRM) was very different (well beyond the RPD). I was blown away Brian (you think I am all high and mighty but I am not…I being helpful based on my experience). I had many conversation shortly after that trying to figure out why the results were so different. I was not doing any duplicate testing at that time (which is required of certified people 1 out of 10 tests, I realized why at that point why we do duplicate testing). Well, I can tell you that I was not prepared to call my previous clients and let them know that that one device was no longer reading radon level correctly and I did not know for how long it was not reading it correctly. What an awful experience Brian! We take it all for granted, we think that each of these devices (CRMs) are infallible…Since then I started testing with two each time and after well over a 1000 duplicate test I can definitely say that roughly 1 out of 20 tests will have results that are well outside the RDP. Now, this is not so bad when the results for both CRMs are well above 8.0 pCi/L but it is a huge issue when it is between 3.8 and 4.3. Brian, I also test my devices before I place them in the field for live testing. Back in Dec/Jan I bought 4 more AirThings and two of the devices were calibrated in the same chamber but had vastly different calibration factors. When I tested them one tested at 3.0 which was the norm for all other devices that tested at that time and the other was 4.7. These were brand new devices Brian and one of them was not calibrated correctly ON ARRIVAL. See the attached picture of part of the support chat I had with Airthings. The point here is that I do two each time, not because I am high and mighty, but because I have enough experience to justify saying that all radon devices cannot be trusted all the time. I am still blown away that I received a device that was not calibrated correctly, So, here you guys are all bashing me when I am trying to be helpful. All you supposedly Internachi certified folks implicitly trust the devices, do not calibrate your devices and do not do duplicate checks…because, you do not care…it is just an add-on service to your home inspection and as a home inspector you are a generalist not a subject matter expert (although InterNachi ‘certified test’ implies you are). So, this last part was the turning point Brian. I finally met my client’s wife. She had early stages of lung cancer (most likely from smoking) but they did not know with certainty. I can definitely say that they knew more about radon, at that time, than me. People tend to do a lot of research when they are diagnosed with whatever. Their old home had a radon level of 13 pCi/L, it was a home test they performed with a canister. It is an unfortunate situation but I feel confident with my test results now. I test my devices before I put them in the field. I cover my butt in everyway possible with duplicate testing. Again, meanwhile you all feel very comfortable looking past the information I share with you, call me know-it-all, berate me,when you all are no better than me when I tested those 3 houses described above (BTW, I was InterNachi Certified at the time)
All you folks Not even remotely accurate. Do not calibrate your devices Not even remotely accurate Do not do duplicate checksNot even remotely accurate. Duplicate checks are performed as required…just not when YOU think it is necessary Do not care Not even remotely accurate.
These are the kind of statements that diminish your credibility and cause your message not to be received.
You believe radon testing should not be performed by anyone who is not AARST certified.
Guess what? You do not control the universe and never will!
To me it smells like his business in being desecrated by what he believes are inferior inspectors, and in an act of desperation, he intends to diminish them, rather than focus on himself.
Good morning Burp, I will respond to your 1 through 4 items and then you last comment:
I follow the criteria for certification as outline through NRPP and AARST. InterNachi training is just that…training. Home inspectors are generalists not subject matter experts but InterNachi suggests otherwise when stating their training makes a person ‘certified’. Sorry, not my idea.
Who said ‘grave’?. When home owners make a consumer choices about the service for radon testing they are at less risk when choosing someone who is properly certified such as NNRP/NRSB. FACT.
The test was inconclusive, the testing environment was interfered with. If you accept the test results as is then I recommend you stay out of radon testing. If you simply say PASS/FAIL without studying the data you people people at risk.
You make no sense here…I recommend a long term test for all customers regardless of the test results. A 48 hour test is a snap-shot of a short duration which is not a clear picture of radon that crosses between seasons. So, yes it makes sense to test long term for everyone. These are simple passive charcoal devices which you set up according to the instructions and then send to a lab for analysis. The point here is that the home owner is placing the passive devices but not doing the analysis…that ‘certified lab’ is interpreting the results, not the homeowner or the InterNachi ‘certified’ person.
So, in terms of testing it is a well-know fact…which is also stated in the InterNachi training, that the most accurate testing is a long term test over the course of a full year (Charcoal or EPERMS), then other types long term tests at 91 days to 365 days. Next up is short term term tests: If we have absolute certainty that closed-building conditions exist then nothing is better than following the protocol using charcoal canister…which, BTW, is always with 2 canisters…hhhmmm why is that they always use 2 Burp? Even with closed building conditions it is good to use CRMs because they tell the story such as issues with HVAC that might bring in or exhaust radon, canister do not tell a story of the 48 hours. The next best is duplicate testing (1 out of 10 tests) which is required for all properly certified professionals and stated clearly in the InterNachi training…Do you know why AARST requires duplicate testing Burp? Because you cannot trust the CRMs 100% of the time (I have personal experience here with bad CRM tests). In terms of 48 hour testing and providing near instant results (after studying the barometric pressure, humidity and temp) duplicate CRM testing cannot be any better while maintaining confidence in the devices being used. (This does not include a sniffer which is live results, sniffers do not have the capacity to run for 48 hours although some of the old WL devices come close). In a real estate transaction with dubious home owners charcoal canisters and EPERMS have the least confident, then a single CRM, next best is a single CRM with a canister/EPERM, next best is duplicate CRM, and the most confident 48 hour test which also tells the story is duplicate CRM with charcoal canisters.
A InterNachi ‘Certified Tester’ is better than someone who does not have any training. But from a consumer who is choosing between ‘certified’ radon testers then yes the best choice is NRPP/NRSB. The highest risk is the uneducated tester because they have no proof of training nor do they have public proof their devices are calibrate, unlike the NRPP/NRSB exam the InterNachi training is not completed with a proctored final exam (Cheating is remarkably easy) and InterNachi does not have a public forum stating if a “certified’ tester has a calibrated device and if they know how to properly interpret their device and which devices they use. NRPP certified radon professionals have public profiles which list the devices (here is mine) …to have device listed device on NRPP means the following has happened: The device has been sent to an independent lab to be tested as OK, it has been calibrated annually (yes NRPP removes devices that have not been calibrated annually) and finally that the radon professional has passed a 'Device Performance Test (DPT)”. A NRPP certification will be dropped if criteria like all that is not complete and if continuing education cannot be kept up with…yes, there are updates in the industry of radon testing. So, the un-educated and the InterNachi do not have that level of rigor…not even close. Which is why hiring a properly certified radon professional has the least amount of risk.
The ‘Universe’ Brian? Wow!
How do you back up ‘remotely close’ do you have some sort of method to measure all those statements Brian? Or are you being emotional and just throwing out the statement because it sounds good? Based on the conversation in this thread alone it is absolutely clear that you all would rather bash someone than listen. Have a great day Brian. Keep up the good work, I have confidence in you.
That we do. Once again. Side by side testing every time is YOUR opinion. Just like a**holes, everyone has one. I think you should take that argument up with your certifying organization.
^^^^^Looks like marketing material to me.
Next time you are on this forum, I hope it is to encourage people to elevate their training. Show some marketing benefits etc. I find your approach condescending.
Have a great fathers day Brian…glad you are willing to elevate yourself and other to their greatest potential. Some people reach it…The rest of us make a better living because most do not. I sleep better at night knowing I have done everything possible, within my capabilities, to deliver the best service because my client’s health is sacred. And yes, I am hired far more than my competitors because I am less of a risk…which is why, during our busy season here, most of my devices are in-service. You can lead a horse to water…you cannot make them drink even when it will benefit them.
All the best to you!
Bill, here is what I gleaned. This free, online course is approved by NRPP, AARST, and IAC2. To become a NRPP Certified Radon Measurement Professional, you’ll have to complete an approved course, pass the NRPP exam, and complete the NRPP application.Visit NRPP for details. View the approval.
I was thinking more along the lines of, join the Police Academy or the Federal Bureau of Investigation myself. Then I would be able to keep my clients safe. As well, He did say ‘be your best.’ Wasn’t that Trumps’ wifes Slogan, “Be Your Best”?
